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Advice? 400g In-wall idea. Advice on stand?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Actuary, Mar 11, 2016.

  1. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    I currently have a 180g in wall aquarium in my current house. My wife and I are moving so I naturally view this as a good time to upgrade. Unfortunately the house we're purchasing doesn't have a great open wall with access on the other side with the exception of our bar area which doesn't allow for as long of a tank as I would like. We would be able to fit a 6 ft long tank behind the bar and I'm currently leaning towards an acrylic 72x36x36 (400 gallon) display which would take up the majority of the wall.

    My top concern now is how to build a stand into the wall that will be able to support a tall tank that's sitting relatively high (probably 45 inches high). I've even considered going with a Schiemer stand with cinder blocks and H beams (google schiemer aquarium stand). Any suggestions or concerns?

    Thanks!
     

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  2. blackx-runner Administrator Website Team Leadership Team

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +738 / 5 / -0
    While that would be cool, I think the PITA factor of a tank that deep would steer me away. My 250DD can be a pain and it's only 27" deep. A 30" tank would be as deep as I would ever go.

    But back to your original question a properly designed steel stand would take that weight no problem and wouldn't need to be crazy large and intrusive. The blocks in place of legs are an interesting idea, eliminates some angle bracing that would probably be necessary with steel uprights of some kind. Leaves everything real nice and open under the stand.
     
  3. abower Well-Known ReefKeeper

    466
    Ryan, Ia
    Ratings:
    +74 / 1 / -0
    Is this going on a concrete floor?

    Stand looks legitimate. I would fix the two ibeams together so you could put 1" bolts between beams and CMU as a leveling system. You would need a plate with a 1 1/8" hole atop the CMU to allow the bolt to slide up and down.
    I despise fixed stands. Takes a large time investment to shim just perfect. with levelers you can put 1/4 inch water in tank, spin some nuts and get it just right with small turns
     
  4. Placid

    280
    Norwalk, IA
    Ratings:
    +60 / 2 / -0
    Whats the depth. Need to really focus on the weight per square inch (weight within footprint). If its a 6 ft 400 Gallon this has to be deep and tall. On rough numbers a 2x4, 2x6 construction can likely support this. Could also go beefer and do cradle bracing or 4x6, 4x4 studding.
     
  5. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    Oh, one other thing I should have mentioned. I absolutely understand the PITA factor of a deep tank.. in particular in a reef tank. My current in wall is very painful to try to clean glass.. the SPS growth leaves a very narrow opening for me to even access the front pane. However, I'm planning on this being a FOWLR tank so I don't imagine the conditions will cause prolific coralline algae growth or limit my ability to access the front pane.

    I'd prefer to avoid having a custom steel stand built. If I can pull off a cinder block/beam stand or build a wooden stand that would be ideal. The stand will sit on a concrete slab.. regarding the leveling idea you mention, you don't think that's too much weight sitting on 4 bolts? My other concern with the cinder block idea is that I would really like to have the front edge of the aquarium supported by the studs in the wall so the aquarium is only inset the depth of the drywall. I have some concerns about mixing wood and cinder block/ibeams to support the tank.. not sure they will compress/expand together very well.
     
  6. Dave Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines Area
    Ratings:
    +450 / 1 / -0
    Having a 30" deep acrylic tank I would never, ever go acrylic again. I cant even imagine the string of obsenities an acrylic tank that deep would prompt me to say come cleaning time! Sounds like a great project though!
     
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  7. abower Well-Known ReefKeeper

    466
    Ryan, Ia
    Ratings:
    +74 / 1 / -0
    4 - 1/2" bolts hold the receiver to the frame, a 3/4" pin secures the hitch to the receiver and a 1 1/4" bolt on the ball secures that to the hitch.. It's the grade that you use. You want grade 8. They are the strongest and will resist rust better. cost difference per ibs is small over grade 5 or 2(standard/not specified). But yea. Cinder blocks are cheap, mortar is decently priced and a couple I beams from the place on 6th St SW cedar Rapids should be reasonable.
     
  8. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    Very interesting idea with the leveling system. I will have to keep that in mind. I was initially hoping to be able to get it pretty well leveled between the mortar and metal shims if necessary between the cinder block and beams.

    I've also had some concerns with 36 inches possibly being too deep. I definitely understand that in order to clean the bottom of the front pane I will pretty much have to be laying across the tank wearing a snorkeling mask with my face down in the tank. Again, without the relatively high Ca/Alk and lighting that you have in a reef, I'm hoping that the coralline algae will be a little more manageable. I have also considered a Marineland 300g deep dimension (glass) instead which is only 27 inches high. Having experience with an in wall tank already I realize how often I need to put my weight along the back/top edge of the tank... I would have some serious concerns doing that on a glass tank. However all of my previous large tanks have all been acrylic, so maybe I'm too worried about the strength of a large glass aquarium.
     
  9. Drewster

    223
    Cedar Rapids
    Ratings:
    +55 / 0 / -0
    Are you planning on having any kind of access panels above the tank on the display side? At 36" wide and 36" deep I'm afraid you wouldn't even be able to reach the bottom of the front panel if you only have access from the back. That's a long reach out and down.
    My 300 is 30" deep and 24" wide, its a huge pain in the butt to reach across and down, couldn't even imagine what it'd be like at the dimensions you're thinking. One thing I've learned through my years of keeping tanks, accessibility goes hand in hand with maintenance. The harder it is to access things the less likely you are to regularly maintain them because of the struggle it requires.
     
  10. abower Well-Known ReefKeeper

    466
    Ryan, Ia
    Ratings:
    +74 / 1 / -0
    My cut off if I upgrade is armpit to tip of thumb.
     
  11. blackx-runner Administrator Website Team Leadership Team

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +738 / 5 / -0
    For that issue I would say move the blocks and beams so they sit "inside" the wall. You're going to have to do some construction anyway. A notch for the blocks in the bottom plate, cut the lower studs to sit under the front beam. I see you have some plumbing and electrical that might not make that possible, but I think it would take away the concerns of the tank being supporter by different materials and structures.
     
  12. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    Hrmm.. that would be about 30 inches. However, the algae scraper I currently use should still allow me to reach the bottom of a 36" deep tank.
     
  13. abower Well-Known ReefKeeper

    466
    Ryan, Ia
    Ratings:
    +74 / 1 / -0
    Remember you don't want your armpit in the tank. So figure the scraper +4", less the pit -4". Deodorant does not wash off well and probably not something you want leaching in the tank. And you will likely be going to tank bottom far more often than just cleaning
     
  14. Dave Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines Area
    Ratings:
    +450 / 1 / -0
    You also lose leverage the deeper you go and risk busting corals as they grow.....and you might end up with a tank that looks like this after a couple of years.

    Note the bottom few inches of coraline. Did I mention I am not a fan of deep acrylic tanks? :)
     
  15. abower Well-Known ReefKeeper

    466
    Ryan, Ia
    Ratings:
    +74 / 1 / -0
  16. Dave Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines Area
    Ratings:
    +450 / 1 / -0
    Sorry. Struggling with uploading from my phone. Will do tonight.
     
  17. Dave Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines Area
    Ratings:
    +450 / 1 / -0
    Here is the pic I was referring to. The problem is not only the leverage but the limited choice of tools to use (basically plastic on plastic) and the darn stuff still scratches if you look at it wrong!

    [​IMG]

    And I'm 6' so no t-rex arms here :). Currently in the process of planning a reboot with this system and going to glass (probably a 300DD which I looks like made your short list as well. Good luck with whatever you choose to do as it will be a great project!
     
  18. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    Totally understand that. Again, this tank is going to be a FOWLR system, so I'm not so worried about corals growing into my path (I'm familiar with this and it's a nightmare in my current system). Also shouldn't have that prolific of coralline growth.
     
  19. tangers Well-Known ReefKeeper

    455
    Ankeny
    Ratings:
    +155 / 0 / -0
    If you do go with an acrylic tank I recommend getting a mighty magnet. I have had one for every acrylic tank I've ever owned and wouldn't have one without one. My tank is by no means perfect but far better than it would be with out it. I've had one for up to 1 1/2" acrylic before and I know they make thicker. Different pads for different tasks, all replaceable to ensure a clean pass and less scratches.
     

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