(*&$(&*APEX!!!!

What I'm trying to say is that yes, virtually all electronic devices will get weird from time to time and require a restart.  Is it good?  No.  Is it the way things are?  At times, yes.  Are any controllers on the market immune from this?  To my knowledge, no.  Ever have to power cycle your cable modem?  Or TiVo?  Or computer?  It's up to us as reefkeepers to put in some kind of contingency plans to keep an eye out for things like this...put a digital thermometer on the outside of your aquarium so that you can see what the temps are and if they don't match your Apex, something is wrong.  Put a webcam on your tank and if things don't look healthy, check it out.   Monitor it with external software.  I use my auto-sig image to keep an eye on things.  If my temp, pH or ORP looks out of whack, I take a look.
Also consider this.  What happens if you have a heater fail?  You indicated that you were using heaters that don't have a dial on them to set.  Really?  I let the Apex manage my heaters, but I still set the dial on them so that if my heater outlet were to get stuck "ON", that it only goes to around 79 degrees...and I hope and pray that my EB8, or temp probe and heater thermostat don't all decide to fail at the same time.  It's up to us to be smart about how we manage things.  Let the Apex do work for you, but don't let it be your only protection from devestation or you're just setting yourself up for failure.
I'm not sure why your skimmer is down...you need a controller to watch your skimmer?  Really?  Tell me more about this skimmer because I don't understand how that would be the case...
It's recommended to follow best practices (read http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/s...?t=1265152 and http://reeftech.webs.com/Apex%20New%20User%20Guide.pdf - they contain plenty of best practices) when setting up your Apex to make sure your code compensates when it can for failed/failing probes, power outages, and other conditions.  Don't rely on your Apex being bulletproof...rely on it to help you do some of the more mundane tasks that you don't want to do, but always keep a watchful eye.
Don't like the breakout box?  Don't feel like it's up to par?  Send it back!  If I get a product and it's shoddy, I send it back and get my money back.  I made my own breakout box for that reason...and because I thought it was overpriced for what it is.
As far as the Apex not being able to divide by 2, well, I use a calculator for that...I bought my Apex to automate my reef, not do my simple math... .  OK, but in all seriousness, I've not tried to do anything yet that the Apex can't handle...so from my perspective, I guess I'm still operating within the confines of the programming capabilities.  Maybe my setup is just primative in comparison to yours...


And for the record, I've never said the programming was a breeze, but I will say that for 60% or more of the tasks that you need to do, there's built in wizards so that you don't have to do the programming on your own...and for the things where you actually *do* have to do programming, there's a forum of people on RC to help you with it.  That's where I got the code for my dosing pumps.


And as for the manual, it's not as good as it can be, but once again, go back to the user community to fill that gap with the Unofficial Apex New Users guide.


Go back to the posts on RC and really take a look at them.  You will find the majority of them are people that don't know how to program code and want to do something the wizards can't handle, can't (or just won't) read the manual, trying to get a DIY device working have an issue with it, trying to get a third party device to work (including their own home network), or have an unrelated software issue (like a browser issue).  The people go to the board to recieve help...and that's what they get.  Yes, there are a few that have actual hardware issues, and sure, sometimes things get broken in transit or are not caught by quality control, but you will find that with every company.  Heck, my refrigerator came dented.  I sent it back and they got me a new one.  It happens. 
Think about this...where are the people that are posting because everything is going good?  Oh yeah, everything is going good so they don't need to post about it...or they're helping someone else out that's having an issue.  If the controllers caused more problems than the addressed, they would be unnecessary and nobody would purchase them.  I know I've certainly not found this to be the case.
Your assessment of 90% of Apex owners being unsatisfied with them...well, I can tell you that's clearly wrong just using GIRS as the sample group.  Maybe 90% vs 10% with you being the 10% unsatisfied? 
And this is no flame war...  And just because I'm pres of the club doesn't mean that my opinion and experiences should be given more weight than anyone else's that uses a controller...I'll let the capabilities of my controller speak for itself as to what it can do, can't do and it's reliability track record.
The moral of your story, absolutely dead on...check your tank daily and keep a close eye on things.  It's not a matter of *if* something will fail, it's *when* and hopefully you've programmed your controller good enough to help you compensate for such a condition and you get an alert. 
If I were you, I would go back to the high tech timers that you were using before your controller and get back to a time when life was simpler and you were happier.  If your Apex is causing you nothing but headaches, it's not worth keeping.  I would implore you to sell it to someone who'se willing to deal with the limitations of it not being able to do simple math and not coming with a great manual.
Respectfully,
--AJ

 

For engineers like you and people that are dead set on doing things better, check out the Reef Angel controller.  It's open source, you can modify the code, make your own components, etc.  http://www.reefangel.com/  Then if/when it fails, you can only blame yourself. 
--AJ

 

I find it comforting that he was willing to stick with you until you were able to find resolution.  And since it's under warranty, you should be able to get it replaced free!  Oh happy day!
--AJ

 

Yeah, he'll be the first to say he's not a "people person"  haha...but it sounds like an open invitation to send your EB8 in for warranty replacement to me.  That would be my next step.
--AJ

 

How would this have played out with Tunze? Send it in, and I will fix it and send it back to you. Roger wouldn't leave you in the lurch. We can't expect that everything we purchase will be perfect, or rather that every single piece that a company sends out will be flawless, but what we can expect is that when it isn't, that they do the right thing without asking to see your proof of purchase. They should tell you to send it in and they will send it back repaired or replaced. End of story.

Build your own Bluefool! Get a table at MACNA. That would be amazing.

 

Curt's a prick, has been for years and I've told him so several times. Everything I've ever purchased from neptune has been crap, had non stop issues (which were never the companies fault), or were on back order for months. I've been around and had the experience to had owned the first, second and third edition or aqua controllers....had issues with all of them. First ones were bugged from the minute they came out, second ones were the same way, the third one I had an actual all out screaming match with curt on the phone over a temp probe. Mind you at the time my temp probe was "damaged" so were 5000 other temp probes neptune sold then ironically blamed the people who bought them for "damaging" them..... After yelling for well over an hour about how the h*ll a temp probe gets beat around in a return chamber floating in cased in a piece of Styrofoam he decided maybe he should just cave in and admit his product was **** and replace it.
A month later i had single sockets randomly going off and on in my dc8...again my fault
I'll never buy from neptune again just based on customer service. If your paying that much out of pocket you should get respectful service
On a side note....never let a controller hold your tank hostage.....its nice to use them for some tasks but when you let it get out of hand its a ticking time bomb.....do some research on how many great tanks are gone because of controller miss hap's, automation gone wrong or safety measures not in place. Simple mistakes can cost thousands

 

remember HAL 9000 !!!!

 

+1  You should get respectful, or at least acceptable customer service...
--AJ

 

Yes, bad/rude customer service is unacceptable, but with that said, I can kind of imagine Kurt's situation. I'm guessing that a good number of the people that call or email him for support are in over their heads to begin with even with a fully functional controller, so it's got to be frustrating. Of course, he could remedy some of that by taking the time to actually provide usable documentation for his products.

As for Tunze, they do have great support, but I'm willing to bet that they sell a lot more product and that their average markup per items is a higher, so they can probably "afford" it better than Neptune can...

-JB

 

Being small is even a bigger reason that their customer service should be the best. Tunze wouldn't HAVE to be so good, but they are. That's largely because Roger Vitko makes them so good. That said, Curt was helpful for me when I was setting up my ACjr.

 

Yeah, I did hit my head on the mantle on Saturday, but I don't think that's impaired me judgment...   And I promise...my kids are just fine.  Well fed, clothed, educated...I promise.  haha
--AJ

 

build two blue and let me try one on this tank i just bought

 

Or buy a Reefkeeper!