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Chemical imbalances

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Fence13, Nov 30, 2013.

  1. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0

    Is there a general reasoning for imbalances in the mg, ca and alk ratio's for our reef tanks? Is it all absorption from the corals for calcium and then the low calcium affects the alkalinity, which can also through the magnesium off balance?



    With consistent water changes each week, I'm trying to figure out what if anything caused my Mg to drop. My calcium was a little low (380) and now while I've raised it up again, the alk and mg have started to slowly drop. And because the low mg is below 1200 I've now started a small dose for that too.


    Was just curious as to what you people thought.
     
  2. blackx-runner Administrator Website Team Leadership Team

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +738 / 5 / -0
    Often times the salt mix we use isn't "balanced" in the first place. Have you ever checked those parameters of your mix water?
     
  3. Sponge Expert Reefkeeper Vendor

    Marshalltown, IA
    Ratings:
    +233 / 1 / -0

    While I may be way off, it's my understanding that the water can only hold so much alk, ca and mag {along with the other essential/trace elements}. So if you have high mag, for example, the water will hold less ca and/or alk. If you have high ca and mag both, the alk will be lower and thus not as available to the corals...maybe not enough so that it interferes with growth (not just size either...), lower pH, etc. There is also the Redfield Ratio that some adhere to/believe. You can 'google' Redfield Ratio if you'd like (Reef Central also has some info/comments on it).


    As far as figuring out what may have caused the mag to drop, mag is used in the tank by several things (corals, coralline algae, etc). It just isn't used as quickly as CA and ALk. That's why at some point, some have to dose Mag. Also, as David said, the salt mix may have been deficient/too low in Magnesium for what the tank needed. Testing the newly made salt water, especially before adding it to the tank, can be a very good idea as the water you add may be much higher in CA and Alk, than what's in the tank and therefore could possibly stress/shock the inhabitants...depends on levels, size of tank, amount of SW being added, etc.


    Others may be able to explain it better than I have. /DesktopModules/ActiveForums/themes/_default/emoticons/blink.gif
     
  4. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    I'm using Reef Crystals (as most do) and I did notice on some digging around online that the salt could have settled from sitting so long which could partially contribute to improper chemical amounts in the water changes (as you both said could be a factor) and I'll test the water before I do my change today to see, I suspect most of Reef Crystals could have a lower Mg than the 1300 we ideally like to achieve in our tanks.

    It could be an absorption thing like you mentioned Sponge; however, I would have thought that the 10% weekly water changes would have helped replace those levels. But that was assuming the levels were correct in the replacement water. It could have all been creeping along so slowly that I'd have never known /DesktopModules/ActiveForums/themes/_default//emoticons/smile.gif Glad I test.
     
  5. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    I take that back, well part of it at least. from the test of the new saltwater it read 1350 mg, 440 ca and the high part was the alk at about 9.3.
     
  6. mthomp

    mthomp Inactive User

    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    That's not jgh for alk. I try to keep it between 9 and 11
     
  7. hart

    hart Well-Known ReefKeeper

    730
    Ratings:
    +131 / 0 / -0
    While this is true with many things, saltwater is a bit more complex. Keeping higher Mg will allow the water to contain more Ca and alk. Seems strange, but true! High Mg interferes with the crystallization of calcium carbonate allowing saltwater to be "supersaturated". This article explains better than I can:

    http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-07/rhf/

    We are very lucky to have a world class chemist like Randy in this hobby!!

    My Alk is generally around 7. I know ULNS folk like to keep it around there as SPS seem to burn much above 9 in a ultra low system just FYI.

    Remember that stony corals use alk and calcium to make their skeleton, not just Ca, so that does alter the water chemistry quite a bit and is why lots of folks dose Ca and alk together. (I like limewater) I would advise caution however, while you need to dose if your system falls below the accepted minimum values, I see many people that end up chasing numbers for no reason. They just keep messing with the system and do more harm than good. Your levels are a bit low so dosing is warranted, but always start by brining the Mg up before messing with Ca and alk for the reasons in the article.
     
  8. Fence13 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Des Moines
    Ratings:
    +300 / 1 / -0
    You're right, it's so easy to get drawn into the numbers.
     
  9. blackx-runner Administrator Website Team Leadership Team

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +738 / 5 / -0
    If everything looks fine, then just monitor and take it slow with any adjustments, if you decide to make them. Set up dosing on the cautious and slow side and monitor daily. I prefer making changes over long periods of time with smaller doses than looking at the various calculators and dumping XX amount of solution to hopefully hit the "magic" number. Dosing pumps and automation make this task simple and easy.
     

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