Curious about your thoughts on this subject.

I was in a discussion about this that started off with splitting BTA's. This damned PETA lady as saying how cruel it was to slice them or even try to split them by unnatural means. But cutting corals were fine.

I believe that the less from the oceans the better.

 

I have to agree with everyone on the wild stuff to a extent.  Some people might criticize me, but o well.  I will point out another side to this argument.  By some people to a extent, like people growing coral, I feel that it is fine to take some coral out of the ocean.  Why you might say, well simple because with coral dying off it is nice to have some people trying to keep it alive for the hobby, even though some day it might be all gone out of the ocean.  People taking the wild stuff, are keeping it around for the good of the hobby.  Everyone might not agree, and I myself might not agree, but its a valid argument. 

 

If you also read I said I did not agree with Wild caught stuff, I just said that that was a argument. Some people will say the aqua cultured stuff isn't as good.

 

I think the future of coral reefs will be created by corals from aquariums. I myself only have one coral that's wild, and I'm not 100% sure if it is actually wild or not.

 

Yea thats the other thing, how do you know if its wild caught. Doesn't everything start off wild caught in all honestly? Start of the line had to be wild caught, then just made its way over a long time to us.

 

We will always have a need for some wild caught. But should be monitored for what and how many in each region to not off set a natural balance.

 

Yea, but so do all freshwater fish. That's why Pet Smart doesn't sell saltwater stuff, they said they don't believe in selling wild caught stuff. I had quite the argument with them one day on the thousands of things they can have that are captive raised/grown.

It's part of the education on how not to take from the wild, but people don't seem to care any more. It's SOO easy to aquaculture corals, I still think 100% of corals should be captive bred.

Saltwater fish on the other hand needs some work. Not too many companies are trying very hard to raise many fish other than clownfish or gobies. Tangs and other fish have been known to spawn in HUGE tank, but no one knows anything about raising their young. More needs to be done to gain knowledge on this...

 

I think education and regulations to things would be the key to the argument here. Weather fish or coral

 

Yes I agree,

I have talked with Calfo & Borneman on this as I someday want to get into aquaculture.

They say the writing is on the wall & in the next decade or so wild imports of fish & coral will be greatly reduced or eliminated. Allready in Europe it is illegal to import any type of Euphyllia (torch, frogspawn, bubble, etc).

And yes I am guilty about buying some wild stuff myself.

 

I agree we should all try to buy tank raised corals and fish. Matt did have a good point though, all of it originated in the ocean.
I think the club needs to decide if it wants to be a reef society or a reef aquarium society. Point being I think we could use profits to go towards reef conservation.

 

I think keep it in the ocean. We have enough stock right now that we should never have to pull any more coral unless everyones tank crashed at once. Then from another view is maybe coral would be better in our tanks then in the ocean. I read an article about a bunch of coral, fish and inverts around the Florida area just devastated with loss. With all the weird stuff going on with climates around the world maybe the reefs are in trouble.

 

I think getting stuff form people you know (culture din their tanks ...duh) or from a place that does it from tanks is good, but sometimes to get new stuff, you have no choice but to buy it from a place that pulls it from the ocean.

I have done some diving in the Keys, and I know that most of the area is protected around the US if it is endangered...but as for the rest of the world...not as much.

I think the LPS, SPS, and hard coral collectors have more of a concern for where their stuff comes from (since it grows so slow, etc) than soft corals.

-Justin

 

For some things, such as the majority of marine fish, they are almost all wild caught. We should be more mindful that those damsels people buy to cycle a tank are not disposable "tools" to get your tank cycled. There are other more humane ways to cycle a tank. Each fish that is disposed of will surely be replaced by another wild fish. Someday we may exhaust the supply. Maybe one day we will look back and say "Remember when you used to buy those damsels for $6 to cycle our tanks?!"

I think they main purpose of attaining wild caught coral, at this point in time, is to preserve it for posterity. Perhaps only a few responsible places should have this privilege and then be allowed to aquaculture what they have. I'm sure this is what will likely happen in the future.......

I agree about trading amongst our peers and I think our club does a pretty good job or trading and sharing.

 

Posted By Waverz on 02/05/2010 12:44 PM
I'm sure some of you are curious why I have even brought this up.  Truth is, it's tax return time and I am expecting a fairly good sized return so I decided to do some browsing online checking out various vendors.  Some of these vendors fully support aquaculture and some of them don't mention a bit about  
the origins of the corals.  This got me thinking about the impact our hobby has on the reefs as well as the pros and cons of purchasing wild corals.
I thought it was homework for college.
Anyway, its a fun topic to discuss and I feel as a "Reef" club we should be responsible for at least promoting some sort of awareness about the topic.
Agree!!!!

 

For me there is enough right here inside the club. Now , I will have to look it up again, I did find an article where one company had started collecting wild corals from reefs that were dying off in an attempt to save them. Now i do not want to say that that is right or wrong. All in all i think that this is a hard subject because every one of our corals can be traced back to a coral that was taken from the wild. I mean how did we get saltwater corals to start with? I say that we have taken enough from the seas but the reason that they continue to be taken is because people keep buyig them. Plain and simple economics at work. Supply and demand. The thing that we need to do if we want to stop taking corals and fish from the seas is to reduce or eliminate the demand for them. With any bussiness they are in it to make money and if they cannot do that then they have to shut down. Some of the reefs are indeed dying. But is this totally global warming and pollution or in part natural life cycles. Nothing lives forever.
All in all this is a debate that can span generations. We can go back and forth and can argue both side over and over. So why not try this, stop buying from wild catch companies and only buy, get from stuff from cultures and home raised colinies. There are plenty avalible. I have found ove 100 different zoo's, countless sps and lps and more fish than I can ever want or desire. So why buy wild? Simple to get what we dont have. It is something that it seams to be in everyone. People want what they do not have and what they believe others do not have and they want what they cannot get. like I said we can argue both sides real easy. I have just shown that.
So the only real question is this: What do you want? wild or domestic? Shaun

 

While I am a lover of nature, I feel that pollution and such are a far greater threat the the reefs than wild collection. I don't have much in terms of numbers, but I find it hard to believe that such a small hobby (all things considered) could really have a huge effect, especially considering that these things are dieing off naturally. I do like to listen to theories of extinction however, as I find it an interesting topic. We, as humans, have a certain arrogance about our actions, I think. One theory that I find incredibly interesting (especially since I don't think it has been considered by most) is the fact that extinction is natural. Creatures go extinct all the time, and we always find a way to blame ourselves. However, far more creatures have gone extinct in the time before mankind than they have while man has been around. Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to use this as an excuse to pollute our waters and chip down our forests, but what I am saying is that when we see an animal in danger we almost always assume and blame ourselves for the destruction when it could very well be nature's course.
All that said, there should NEVER be a reason to buy wild, regardless of the circumstances, if it is available aquacultured IMO. A lot of the cooler morphs happen aquacultured.

 

Given the choice between aqua/maricultured and wild origin I will take the cultured in a heartbeat. That said, it's primarily due to the fact that it is far more likely to retain coloration in my tank. I actually don't believe I have a single piece of wild SPS but I'm certain my colony of B. Wellsi and one of my Favites are both wild simply because they just don't grow at a rate to make aquaculture a viable option and are both substantial in size. Such is the nature of the hobby imo.