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MayDay! Everything in my tank is dying!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by ThyRaven, Mar 9, 2011.

  1. ThyRaven

    ThyRaven Well-Known ReefKeeper

    919
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0
    On Feb 19th for my bday I bought a Singapore angel.  She made it two weeks then died.  72 hours later I lost my green chromis.  I then took some water to my lfs, Pet's Playhouse, they said that my nitrates were a little high.  I don't have any coral yet.  I did switch to a Rapids Pro 1000 on Feb 21st.  I was previously using an Aqua Clear 110 with no skimmer.  The RP1000 has a built in skimmer and I am getting about 8 to 10 oz of really green stinky crap every 24 hours since I turned it on.  Yesterday I had two stripped paired Damsels in my tank.  This morning I checked and had lost the male over night.
    I've been working in the basement on a small remodeling project, while it was til we found mold so it has gotten a little more extensive.  I've painted two coats of Water Tite on the concrete and now hanging Styrofoam prior to studs then drywall here within the next two weeks or so.  Ambient air temp has been around 60.  Tank temp is maintaining 78 with my Marineland Heater I got from Pet Smart.
    My lfs said to do a 50% water change when I took them water and then again in 48 to 72 hours just in case the mold spores got into the water.  I do try to keep the tank covered at all times but even more when I am doing any work close by.  Sadly I do not have a RODI unit yet.  Just ordered one for Purewaterclub.com and hope it gets here by Saturday.  I only have ardyone fish and it'll suck hard core to shut down the tank.
    In order to offset the cost of getting the salt tank functional again, I am selling my 55 gallon fresh water setup.  There isnt much in it as I really want my reef tank.
    Any help or advice to this newbie would be great.  Also if you're close by, I am from Cedar Rapids, and have cheap fish aka chromis and other hardy fish that'll help me get back up and going please shoot me a message.  I am also planning to get another Singapore from a GIRS member here in a few weeks if the misses will let me spend the money.
     
  2. mthomp

    mthomp Inactive User

    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    singapore angels are from my understanding a difficult fish to keep. If it were me I would wait on getting one till you have your system in check and it has been set up for close to a yr. Also can we get a little more info on your tank. IE size, power heads for flow sump size how long it has been set up. I am not familiar with a rp1000 but from your discription it sounds like a filter skimmer combo?
     
  3. JB Veteran Reefkeeper

    Marion
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0
    If you don't have an RO/DI unit, how are you getting water? Are you buying RO/DI or are you treating tap water?
     
  4. ThyRaven

    ThyRaven Well-Known ReefKeeper

    919
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0
    sorry i forgot all my tank specs

    i am using a 55 gallon tall, i have 1 power head - koralis 3 (cant spell), the rp1000 is a mechanical filter, skimmer, and surface skimmer in 1, it can filter 1000 GPH.

    i do not have an actual sump, the rp1000 is an external filter unit that acts like a sump but only holds 5 gallons when in operation but can handle 20 if the power goes out.

    here is a link so you get a better under standing of the unit: http://www.shopmania.com/shopping~online-aquarium-supplies~buy-rapids-pro-series-with-1000-gph-pump-from-tom-rated-for-up-to-150~p-3796740.html

    sadly i am treating tap water the best I can aka removing chlorine and that be it other than what the filter can do for me

    tank has been running for 14 months, 2 weeks, and 4 days

    i have 4" of live sand and 15 lbs of live rock at the current moment.

    since i had the Aqua Clear 110 on prior to the rp1000 I have turned in back on to assist with filtering.

    Anything else you need in order to help me out let me know and I can fill you in. hope my RODI unit gets here fast as I am thinking my water has gone down the crapper.

     
  5. ThyRaven

    ThyRaven Well-Known ReefKeeper

    919
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0
    here is a better link: http://www.dtpetsupplies.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=5197
     
  6. FishBrain Expert Reefkeeper

    New London
    Ratings:
    +399 / 6 / -0
    May be due to the paint fumes.
     
  7. ThyRaven

    ThyRaven Well-Known ReefKeeper

    919
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    +1 / 0 / -0
    i was thinking that too but i mean the fumes werent that bad to me anyway and i did 2 - 12' and 1 - 35' walls by myself in just over a hour. took me longer since i was trying to get it on pretty thick as it is meant to prevent wall from coming thru the concrete.
     
  8. Tina

    Tina

    111
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    I happened to have a mold problem in my basement when i bought my house. I looked into mold inhibitors to paint and spray on. When i got to reading the directions it said caution do not use near streams or bodies of water and that it was extremely toxic to people pets and especially wildlife. The idea is to spray or paint it on. However you arent allowed to rinse it off or it becomes ineffective. I had a discussion with my contractor and decided not to use it because i had planned on having tanks in my basement. If i had used that stuff, i had thought about the possibility of the moisture in the air collecting/absorbing some of the chemical from the walls and ceiling and then circulating throughout the air in the basement. Then, depending on the moisture content in the air, the chemicals could get into the tank via direct interaction (open tank water) or indirect ( chemical humidity settling on fish nets, bottles of chemicals you use for your tank, thongs, gloves, or anything that you would use in your tank that could come in direct content of the water). Perhaps if you were using a mold inhibitor paint, there could have been some of the chemicals in the fumes that somehow got into your tank. Perhaps try using alot of carbon as an attempt to filter the chem out?
     
  9. glaspie69

    glaspie69 Experienced Reefkeeper

    Ratings:
    +41 / 2 / -0
    I'm gunna take a shot in the dark and guess that it's maybe not so much the paint and maybe more the current water. I would maybe check for phosphates, and next time i'd ask what "alittle" high on nitrates means.
     
  10. mthomp

    mthomp Inactive User

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    I agree with Glaspie. In fact I think your "skilter" could possibly be a culprit. From the looks of the link it resembles a canister type filter which are known Nitrate traps.
     
  11. Troy

    Troy Experienced Reefkeeper

    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    Personally I think you might have a number of things that could be the problem. I would check the water, possibly get some RO water when doing these water changes. Have Pets Playhouse test you phosphates. Don't be afraid to make Nick do something for a change. Start with that, and then see what happens.
     
  12. Bud Loves Bacon Website Team Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member Vendor

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,821 / 14 / -0
    High phosphates don't kill fish and you have no corals so that's not it. High nitrates can be tolerated as long as the fish are acclimated to it. That is, as long as they rise as the fish are living in the tank, you can't drip-acclimate a fish to a high nitrate environment. So have your Nitrates tested and lets us know exactly what "high" means, because that's all relative. Being such a sudden issue I would doubt that it is an issue so much with the type of filter as it is the fish dying and decomposing before you can get them out. That throws a lot of ammonia into the tank and you will get fluctuations in tank chemistry, and if you don't have adequate filtration it just takes longer to settle down.

    I would highly suspect the mold sealer for starting the whole thing. I can't remember who I got some corals from town a few months back but he lost all this fish and most corals in his biocube in his office because the cleaning crew used a particular cleaning product on the floor one night, it only took a few days to wipe everything out. To me, this is your culprit.
     
  13. Corallimorph

    Corallimorph Inactive User

    62
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    +0 / 0 / -0

    I am new to this board and certainly don't know everything there is to know about reef-keeping but I have learned some things along the way. "green stinky crap" usually means lots of free algae cell in your water column and that your skimmer needs to be adjusted a bit, more air, less water flow. The goal is more of a dry residue in the cup. 


    Lots of free algae cells suggest too long of a photoperiod and overfeeding. I had a similar problem in one of my tanks. It took adding more live rock (2-3lbs per gallon) and 2 water changes a week for a month to get the nitrate levels back down to a manageable level. The tank is very happy and stable now.


    Have you checked the ammonia and nitrite levels? Replacing the aqua clear 110 with such a small amount of live-rock may have taken out a good portion of your biological filter and cause your tank to cycle again.


    Also what kind of CUC do you have?


    Good Luck!
     
  14. Corallimorph

    Corallimorph Inactive User

    62
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  15. Andy The Reef Guy

    Andy The Reef Guy Inactive User

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    +0 / 0 / -0
    +1 Phosphates don't kill fish

    +1 on canisters being nitrate traps, actually they're not so much nitrate traps as they are detritus traps that subsequently produced ammonia, and ni-trites/trates. That TOM filter is more like a wet dry filter though I believe, and wet/dry filters are commonly accused of being NO3 factories (which is accurate to a greater or lesser extent). In any case, I would be diligent about taking that thing apart and cleaning out the detritus within it at least once every 3 months.

    -Yeah I'd like to know what the nitrates are, but more importantly, I'd like to know what your kH is, if these deaths are occurring over night, a plausible scenario is that your pH is swinging really low with the net increase of CO2 (minus the day time metabolic uptake of CO2 from algae/zoxanthellate/etc.). I've seen that happen more times than I can count.

    -Disease is certainly not out of the question, at this point you'll probably never know if that were the case.

    -The paint fumes (and antimicrobials) are certainly a possible culprit. Really there are just too many variables to know without doing a full workup. What you want to do is perform kH, pH tests 2-3x/day for a few days.

    Of course at this point subsequent water changes may well have replenished depleted carbonate supplies and stabilized water parameters for the time being.

    I would like to have some follow-up on your situation, with report on the discrete level of nitrates, and your kH and pH taken at "sunrise" and "sunset" (relative to your lighting schedule). I think even if troubles have subsided and you've written this off to paint fumes, that may not be the case, and a little bit of investigation now could help you figure this out and avoid troubles in the future. Drop me a message or just pop a post, and I hope all is well!

    -Andy
     
  16. ThyRaven

    ThyRaven Well-Known ReefKeeper

    919
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0
    waiting on my RO filter. I am starting to wonder if the people at the shop just sold the RP1000 to get it off there shelf. Nothing about nitrate problems or anything building up inside so thanks for the warnings ahead of time. I'll probably start work towards a full functional sump. The misses is getting mad that I keep spending more and more money on the tank..

    I dont have any personal test kits as of yet, I'll try to round some up since I got paid today. I probably should've left the Aqua Clear 110 on for a few days after starting the RP1000 but yet again the misses is having a cow over how much power I am using and the bills going up and up so idk at this rate I might just tear it down since I cant spend any time or money on it. I'll keep you posted on levels when I can get back to my lfs for testing.
     
  17. mthomp

    mthomp Inactive User

    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    If you do decide to ditch they skilter you are using, I ran a bio wheel filter minus the wheels just to run carbon in, and a HOB skimmer from octopus. this along with my powerheads and live rock worked great for me on my 55.
     
  18. Armydog

    Armydog Expert Reefkeeper

    Ratings:
    +738 / 8 / -0
    I ran my 55 with tap water for a year and my fish were fine so thats not it.... How long has your tank been set-up
     
  19. Andy The Reef Guy

    Andy The Reef Guy Inactive User

    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    dang man, I just don't get it with you guys who have wives that give em hell about reef tanks. I've got 2 40's laying in the middle of the living room (ones going to be a sump for my 120 and two 40 gallons (one 40 is already up and on this system)), power tools, and pvc and crap all over the place, my wife never makes a peep! She asked me when I might be done with this transition and I said this weekend and she was fine with that!
    As for power consumption, does your wife realize that electricity is 10 cents per kilowatt hour? That means an aquaclear 110 (14 watts) = (14watts) x (24hrs/day) x ( 30days/mnth) x (1/1000watts/kw) x (0.10 dollars/kw) = $1.0008/mth
    That rapids pro does~ 800gph with head pressure, assume that it requires a 110watt pump (its probably closer to 80) = $7.90/mth
    My condolences
     
  20. Andy The Reef Guy

    Andy The Reef Guy Inactive User

    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0
    That's not necessarily true, different localities employ different methods for water treatment. Cedar Rapids has a nasty history of using ammonium chloride.
     

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