PLEASE HELP before ALL a total loss!!!

i dont think it's ich killing a cleaner shrimp or a wrasse. Have you tested your water? This sounds more like a ammo spike or super high nitrates, or a foreign poison of some sort. I would say it's a water problem and thats why your fish went into an ich fit. Check your water that will tell you more. J

 

love how pet store allways say its the tank owner fault we did some thing wrong or things happen thats bull and im sorry you had that happend if u dont have corals turn heat up to 85-87 ich dont like heat hope it works out for ya try to keep fish eating ive had ick a few times most of the time fish get ick when thay get stressed and lose slim coat good luck ..

 

I'm betting water, ich doesnt kill shrimp especially ones that eat ich as a hobby. Ich doesn't kill cleaner wrasses either, cause they eat it also. I would guess that something is either in the water or leaching out of the rock. Nirtates have to come from somewhere, so theres either ammo or nitrites somewhere. And just for the record not defending the LFS ich lives in sand (thats why qt tanks have no sand) so this ich could have come from the sand you moved and been sparked by the new fish entering the tank. Again not to defend or take a side as I'm not batting for either of you but everyone takes a risk in buying fish, the LFS doesnt control what the fish is going to do, if it didn't have ich at the store....it got stressed either from the move home or in your tank. If your buying a fish with a high chance of getting stressed and ich, isn't it the buyers fault for not taking the time to qt the fish. Sometimes you have to sit back and look at the other view, if you sold someone a car and it blew up 2 days later because the guy floored it all the way home....is it your fault the car blew up?

 

Posted By reefguy on 09/01/2008 8:36 PM
 if u dont have corals turn heat up to 85-87 ich dont like heat hope it works out for ya try to keep fish eating ive had ick a few times most of the time fish get ick when thay get stressed and lose slim coat
This is a good way to kill far more than ich

 

I agree with Jason (Glaspie69), Ick is brought out by stress. What are the params in your tank, the numbers. Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, Salinity and temp.
Truthfully it sounds like your fish may be too far gone. If any seem somewhat healthy then you can try hypo-salinity or copper depending on what you have left. Some fish can't handle copper, so if you have them use hypo-salinity. I have used it successfully on an puffer and lion fish.
Do your research, learn the life cycle of Ick. There are many good articles on the internet. Get all fish out of your display and treat in that hospital tank, use tank water so you don't have to acclimate to reduce stress. Then leave your tank fallow for 6-8 weeks. Ick have to have a host to live.
You can also feed garlic and ginger soaked foods. I have also had luck with this in very light cases, but is better as a preventitive.
I hope it is not too late, good luck.

 

Salt water ICH and freshwater are a different parasite. If I remember right the life cycle is quite different.
You should not have any detectable Nitrite. You said your tank has been up a month but you got everything from an established tank. Is that everything, so you more or less transferred the tank to your house?? Did you get fish too? How many fish did you add this month? That Nitrite reading makes me suspect of a cycle going on. Also, your salinity level is quite low, probably not enough to bother your fish, but it is low.
Here is a great article on reef parameters if you haven't read it: http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-05/rhf/index.php

 

Hmmmm....

#1 Which you have learned, is quarantine EVERYTHING including corals and live rock.

#2 Do not dump the LFS water into your tank. I don't know if you did this, but if you did or if the shrimp came in contact with the "treated" fish water it could have contained copper, which inverts are sensitive to.

#3 Ich is only treatable with copper or hyposalinity. Heat can be used to increase the fishes immune system and to speed up the life cycle of the ich. Plan on having your tank fish free for the next 6 weeks. Any earlier than that and you run the risk of an ich flare up again later.

#4 NitrItes mean you have recently had ammonia in the tank and the tank is not well established enough to handle nitrIte to nitrAte production. You should never see nitrIte in a tank with properly established live rock or sand. Did you acclimate the shrimp and new fish? How?

To save your current fish you need to treat them with copper, but finding it can be hard and you will need a copper test kit.

 

You can't treat the tank with corals left in there. The only thing you can do is remove all fish and leave the tank fallow (empty of ICH food) for 6-8 weeks, the life cycle of the Ich organism. I have done a BUNCH of research on this and that is it. I got hit as well because I chanced not quarantining and another time had pH spike that caused extreme stress. Don't try any wonder drugs off the counter for reef tanks they don't work and may kill everything.
Here is a quick article from LiveAquaria that pretty much hits all the bases in a good summarization: http://www.liveaquaria.com/general/general.cfm?general_pagesid=78. However it does not cover hypo-salinity for fish that can't deal with copper. There is plenty of info on that in Reef Central and other places. Just watch where you get your information. Everyone has an opinion, like me. /DesktopModules/NTForums/themes/_default/emoticons/biggrin.gif
I have been to LiveAquaria (well actually The Divers Den) and the quarantine system and system as a whole is absolutely amazing! They can be trusted.
I would hope you can find Mardels Copper Safe for Saltwater fairly easily at the LFS. IT is something that should be kept on hand if you don't quarantine, so you won't need it after this.
You need to get on this immediately. Another thing to remeber is ICH normally gets much worse when the lights are out and may appear to be better in the light, don't believe it.

 

Some will argue that ich is always present in most tanks, but the health of your fish fight it off.

I would say you are hitting your second cylcle.

http://fins.actwin.com/mirror/begin-cycling.html

Notice that the nitrates seem to spike between days 40 & 50. This may have stressed out your fish & made them vulnerable. Alot of us have been in your situation, looking good & then boom.

I would continue to do large water changes & feed well, with garlic if possible. Get the remaining fish into a bare bottom Hosp tank & treat with copper medicine. Remember copper will kill about everything else including LR, sand, and pods,so you will never be able to have anything but fish in the Hosp tank again as the silicone will hold & leach the copper in the future.

It would be best if you can let your display go fishless for 6 weeks. You can still have your inverts in there if you wish.

Good luck
Craig

 

In this situation, the worse thing that you can do is over-react which stresses out the fish more and virtually guaranties their demise.

Just slow down, take a deep breath and correct the problems that you can correct. If the fish have strong immune systems, they will most likely make it through with no problems.

-JB

 

You've gotten a lot of great advice here on this thread and it is a great example of how great this club is and how important the information and support is that you can get from it's members.  I hope that you can get past this very sad experience with new knowledge for the future.  I'm sure that you have helped many people out there just by telling your experience and all the input from other members.  Just remember, the reason that some people know so much is because they've been there or know someone that has.  Now you too can help someone else in the future through your experience.
Keep us posted on how things go and like said before, take a deep breath.  Good Luck!!
Robyn

 

Posted By saltwaternewbee on 09/01/2008 08:06 PM

We have a MAJOR problem! ICH!!!!!! and only 3 fish left. After talking to the shop we bought this vile fish from...here's what has been tried. Charcoal/carbon in LARGE amounts, lights off, temp up, UV sterilizer, Natural/organic ich killer and a freshwater dip.
 
Any other ideas from here that we can try? Here's what happened...
Up till a week ago last Friday, all was GREAT in our tank until that Saturday when we noticed all of our fish had ich BAD!  My wife called the place where the fish was purchased and  it was admitted that his system had ich and "eh, you'll have that."   We didn't have a hospital tank at the time (but do now). So far, we have lost over $350.00 in livestock. We were even sold a cleaner wrasse and a cleaner shrimp because we were told they would take care of it.   ALL we have left is a yellow tang, lawnmower blenny and a perc that isn't going to make it thru the night. 
We have since bought a small tank set up to use as a hospital tank for now and will eventually change over our 40L into a hosipital tank instead since we are going to start putting up the 220 next weekend.  Unfotunately, we had received a lot of misinformation from this same source since this whole thing started and have definitely learned who to trust and who not to trust in this hobby. 

Dear Rich & Karen,

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On Monday an employee of another pet store came in to my store and stated that a particular couple have been in their store several times with nothing but negative things to say about me.  He came into my store and wanted to make sure that it wasn’t said he was the one saying all the crab about me.  He then told me to go to the girs site and read a thread that was posted on Sept. 1st.  I did that and I am shocked to say the LEAST.  I bend over backwards for all my customers because I do not want to be just another fish store.  I never purposely set out to screw any of my customers.  There is no other fish store in Iowa that will give customers the service that I do with very good pricing.  I never claim to know it all and if I don’t know the answer to something I will get it.  I’m so upset right now I don’t know what else to say other then thank you sincerely for your business however I do not need your help on Thursday while I’m in Chicago.

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Gary

 

I'm locking this thread before it takes a turn for the worst. If you all want to continue this, please take it to PM's.

Thanks

-JB