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Plumbing questions

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Kylie, Dec 7, 2010.

  1. Kylie

    Kylie Inactive User

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    Ok. I am working on a 65g to replace my 40 breeder. Last night Adam drilled four holes for 1" bulkheads, one on either end about 4" from the surface for my drains which will have standpipes, and two spaced evenly in the center close to the top for my returns. I have the plumbing inside the yank figured out, but I have a few questions for the outside plumbing.


    the drains will both run to the left side of a 29g sump inside my stand(directly under my tank). The return will then come from my farthest right chamber with a mag 7 going up to the middle two bulkheads.


    The first two questions I have are 1) does it matter if the return or drain piping is closer to the tank? Since apl plumbing is with 1" PVC, I will need to extend either the drain or return piping out farther from the tank wall.


    2)Should I have some way to support the weight of the PVC? It seems like that will be a lot more weight and strain on my glass than I have now.


    Ill start with that for now and ask more questions when they come up. Thanks!!
     
  2. Gered

    Gered Experienced Reefkeeper

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    I think I understand what you are saying about #1. I would keep the drain closer so there is less lateral pipe coming out. This way the water comes into the pvc and straight down into the sump instead of running lateral then down. I hope that makes sense

    As for #2 you can support it but I dont really see a problem. Unless you have lots of pvc weight like a basement sump or something then you might want to support it.
     
  3. Kylie

    Kylie Inactive User

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    If I were to support it for safety, how would you suggest doing that?
     
  4. Gered

    Gered Experienced Reefkeeper

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    Find something like this but for PVC

    http://www.foxelectricsupply.com/content/products/ProductCatalog.asp?qscategoryId=26189
     
  5. Gered

    Gered Experienced Reefkeeper

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    http://plumbing.hardwarestore.com/52-342-galvanized-straps-and-hangers.aspx

    Second row down. Screw them in until the pipe feels secure.
     
  6. Andy The Reef Guy

    Andy The Reef Guy Inactive User

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    IDK Gered, I would almost favor running the return pipe as close to the back of the tank as possible to avoid excess headpressure on that mag7. I get favoring the drain for a quieter and more efficient discharge, but a mag7 isn't going to overwhelm 2x 1" drains anyways.

    I would go with what Gered said IF, you use 45deg elbows to route your plumbing from the return pump, and not a pair of 90deg elbows out of the stand/sump. ie: from the pump, 45deg toward the wall and out the back of the stand, 45deg again directly upward, and T the return directly at the end of the ascent to a pair of 90deg on either side of the T back into the display. Does that make sense? Then yeah, run the drain pipes close to the tank.

    as far as support, you can do this many ways, such as Gered linked, there are straps like that, Menards carries PVC conduit (for electrical PVC) straps just like those that are actually PVC or plastic themselves (which is what I've used) That way you avoid corrosion. Second, a drain sock mount is a great utility for media without a reactor, and can provide drain support. Third, consider that your return line should be built such that the pump itself is resting on the floor in the sump, thus alleviating stress of the weight of the return pvc. And the drains could be built such that where the elbow is made into the stand, the pipe between 2 90deg's rests on the rim of the 29 sump. Like Gered said though, I wouldn't worry about it.

    Does that make sense?
     
  7. Kylie

    Kylie Inactive User

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    Yes that all makes sence. The way you described is how I have my returns on the 40 with 3/4" pvc. Ill go ahead and do it that way again.

    Ill check into the straps also and see if they are worth the extra security. Do you have any suggestions on what angle I should link my drain pipes before the enter my sump? Or should I leave them as two separate pipes the whole way down?
     
  8. mthomp

    mthomp Inactive User

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    I am curious about something maybe one of yall can sort for me. you have 2 drains and 2 returns running off of a mag 7, will the mag 7 be able to keep up? thats a lot of water coming down into the sump. I have a 90gal with 1 overflow and 1 return with a mag9.5 full bore and it keeps up prefectly, I could of even gone bigger
     
  9. Gered

    Gered Experienced Reefkeeper

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    I would not worry how much the mag7 is pushing through the returns. It will do its job just fine because in all reality you are not really looking for flow from your returns. Personally if it was me though I would ditch the mag7 for a maxi-jet utility pump. They are much more efficient and run a lot cooler then mag pumps. Mags are notorious for inefficiency and heat.
     
  10. Gered

    Gered Experienced Reefkeeper

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    It will keep up on the basis of the drains will only drain as much water as the mag7 returns.  If anything you have to worry about having to big of a pump and not having the overflows keep up.
     
  11. Andy The Reef Guy

    Andy The Reef Guy Inactive User

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    Yeah, the amount of flow through the drains is directly dictated by the amount of water pumped from the return pump, an oversized pump is all you have to worry about. The drains should always have a breather vent that runs above the surface of the body of water which it is draining, thus providing a siphon break, and quieter operation.
     
  12. Gered

    Gered Experienced Reefkeeper

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    This is maxi jet pump I am talking about. They are a utility pump and not your normal maxi jet powerhead.  A plus is these can be run internal or external.
    http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=18989
    And here is a review of the larger pump which is the one I am running on my 40.
    http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=196202&hl=
     
  13. Andy The Reef Guy

    Andy The Reef Guy Inactive User

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    Oh yeah I forgot they came out with those! lol I think they were just getting them in at Petland when I went on hiatus. I hated the packaging! lol One of those would probably be great, I guess people are using them and liking them? Gered have you had experience with them? Based on specs and looks I would put them +1 above a Rio, but how have they compared to other pumps (such as the Quiet One)?
     
  14. Gered

    Gered Experienced Reefkeeper

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    I have run 2 of them. I had a smaller one running the 40 then went to the largest to run multiple tanks back when I had the frag tank attached to the system. I am running the largest pump currently which acts as a return and feeds my external skimmer. I could probably hook up my reactor but keep it separate for cleaning purposes. I will be buying another one when I setup the 120 so I can run it as a dedicated return pump and then run the other pump to run accessories.
    Review link also added the post before this. Has some nice pictures of the internals.  I like the impeller style.
     
  15. Kylie

    Kylie Inactive User

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    I think my mag will work fine. Im use to how much it heats my tank and right now have a valve that restricts its power a lot. I like the idea of as much strength as possible for my pvc support and those straps look helpful. My only remaining issue now is whether to join my drains. Ill check the RC calculator. If anyone else has suggestions on this or anything else Im all ears
     
  16. Kylie

    Kylie Inactive User

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    New issue. Just looked at the clips and see that they need to screw into a wall or something. My tank is too far from a wall and the stand to do that
     
  17. Gered

    Gered Experienced Reefkeeper

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    In my opinion do not restrict one of these pumps with a valve.  This causes more heat and stress on the pump. If anything run an extra line off your return and put a valve on that and you can open it up to dump back into the sump. This way you get the flow you want to the tank and you can use the extra line for water changes.  Just throw a piece of hose on it and pump the water into a bucket or something.
     
  18. Andy The Reef Guy

    Andy The Reef Guy Inactive User

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    Wow, yeah look at that nice flanged top on it, that's pretty nice. Yeah that's a centrifugal impellar, they're more efficient and less abrasive.
     
  19. Kylie

    Kylie Inactive User

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    Ok. I'll try to go without the valve. Right now, I think I don't have enough of a drain to allow my mag to go full throttle. Hopefully with the larger water volume and two drains it should work better. When I'm building my pvc I'll see if there's some way I can angle it back to the stand to get it secure with a clip. It shouldn't be a problem then.
     
  20. Andy The Reef Guy

    Andy The Reef Guy Inactive User

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    You should have enough drain, that Mag is only going to pump ~450-500gph at the top, which would be handled almost entirely by a single 1" drain. Two will afford you plenty of draining capacity
     

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