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Advice? Quarantine System/Routine

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Actuary, Oct 4, 2016.

  1. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    After 7 years in the hobby I just had my first major setback. Marine velvet wiped out every fish in my tank including some fish that I have had for my entire 7 years of keeping saltwater fish (which had followed me on two moves across the state). Of course I had always heard how necessary a quarantine tank is... but honestly I don't know that I've ever seen someone else who actually runs one. Needless to say I had never ran a quarantine tank and after 7 years of getting away with it I started to think it was unnecessary. I had periodically seen ich pop up on tangs but never had any real disease issues. Marine velvet is a whole different ballgame. Costly lessons are some of the best teachers... lesson learned.

    I'm letting the display run fishless for several weeks now. I'll be setting up some kind of quarantine system but it seems like advice is all over the place on what type of routine to follow. For example, some say to blanket treat every inhabitant in hypo and copper (or chloroquine phosphate) others say simply observe for 6 weeks before placing into DT and treat if needed. Some advise formalin or freshwater dips on everything before quarantine while others say it's too stressful. Some seem to neglect quarantining inverts, corals, and macroalgaes; others say to quarantine everything wet. Others swear by a certain tank transfer method and others say that won't do anything for certain infections.

    While this issue was devastating it did at least help me convince my wife that I need to take over some additional space in the basement to set up additional tanks for quarantine/treating. I should be able to set up a 55g, 40g, and a 29g. My display is 400g so I'd like to be able to quarantine more than just a fish or two at a time. I am just trying to figure out what I really need to get set up and what routines I should follow.

    So I'm interested in hearing what has worked (and hasn't worked) for those of you who have followed quarantine routines. Specifically:
    • Dips prior to quarantine? Freshwater, formalin, methylin blue?
    • Hypo for everything?
    • Certain treatments for everything? Copper, CP, prazipro, etc?
    • Observe in a quarantine tank and treat in a separate hospital tank if needed?
    • Quarantine inverts/corals/macro algae? Or just dip corals and place in display?
    • Any certain time specific routines would be good to hear.
    I am planning on keeping certain fish which don't necessarily quarantine well (large angels and burrowing wrasses). So I'd be interested in hearing specifics about how to handle them as well.

    I look forward to hearing your thoughts. Thanks!
     
  2. Bud Loves Bacon Website Team Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member Vendor

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,818 / 14 / -0
    Man, another major tank issue...sorry to hear about that @Actuary@Actuary, I'm in the same boat, I don't QT anything, but then again I don't regularly add anything to my tank either.
     
  3. blackx-runner Administrator Website Team Leadership Team

    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +738 / 5 / -0
    That sucks. I'm not familiar with marine velvet. Did you add a new fish to the tank that brought it in, or is that something the fish can carry without really showing symptoms until their immune system is weakened for whatever reason?

    I can say I'm in the crowd of have not quarantined. I've been lucky with my tank I guess. I tried it at one point when I was stocking fish to the tank and it seemed I killed everything that went into the quarantine tank. Had a much better survival rate with just putting stuff in the display. Sorry I can't be of much help there.

    I know @mattman319@mattman319 runs a pretty strict quarantine process. @xroads@xroads runs his fish through QT and observation as well. Hopefully they can chime in with some pointers.
     
  4. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    From what I've read marine velvet doesn't get carried passively. You may not see it show symptoms if the infection is in the gills though. Unfortunately it's a very quick killer and by the time you figure out what's going on it's usually too late. I had added some new fish from an LFS and allowed them to go into the display without quarantine like I always have. The majority of my previous fish purchases have been from liveaquaria.com or Sea of Marvels in North Liberty and never had any issues. As much as I'd like to purchase from an LFS here in Des Moines this experience definitely left a bad taste in my mouth.

    I'm leaning towards treating all new inhabitants prophylactically with chloroquine phosphate for 30 days to knock out any protozoans. This is especially useful for copper sensitive species like angels. However it sounds like wrasses don't handle this treatment very well... so I'll have to figure something else out for them.
     
  5. Ryan Arment

    22
    Marshalltown
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0
    I considered setting up a QT system, but I now just have @xroads@xroads order and QT fish for me whenever I add anything to the tank. He's been great to work with and has a ton of knowledge!
     
  6. xroads Veteran Reefkeeper Vendor

    La Porte City, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,014 / 6 / -0
    If you seen how many diseased fish came in, you would qt everything every time. And I get everything from Quality Marine, the best there is.

    QTing a few fish at a time would be much easier.

    First, acclimate, get them eating, past the stress time, etc. I would add heavy UV and observe.

    I would go with several fresh water dips, and use the tank transfer method.
     
  7. MadManMadrid Well-Known ReefKeeper

    440
    Iowa City
    Ratings:
    +158 / 4 / -0
    Yea im like @blackx-runner@blackx-runner to me it seems when i try to qt fish they always die so i dont do it either
     
  8. mattman319 SoManyTanks

    209
    Cedar Rapids, IA
    Ratings:
    +93 / 0 / -0

    image.jpeg

    I did not quarantine for years. When I set up my 180 I had a crypto outbreak and it wiped out about $1k worth of fish. After that, I set up a quarantine tank immediately. I use copper and not hypo because I run all reef tanks which run at a higher salinity than fowlr tanks are able to get away with. I figure it is less stressful for them to transfer over having gotten used to the same salinity as the reef. I quarantine for a minimum of 2 months. The pic above is an older pic but I still have the same tank going with about 10-12 fish in it. I like the idea of a community quarantine. Tends to help with finicky eaters. Fishy see, fishy do! Lol The design is very simple. Heater, HOB micron filter, circulation pumps and pvc pieces. Make sure to have plenty of pvc for the fish to take shelter in and hide/sleep. This is a 60 gallon and I do 10 gallon water changes weekly, beings that I don't run a skimmer. If u have any questions feel free to fire away!
     
  9. Actuary Well-Known ReefKeeper

    705
    Adel, IA
    Ratings:
    +145 / 1 / -0
    Hrmm.. so it seems like people are all over the place on their methods :).

    @mattman319@mattman319 That looks like a nice setup. That's similar to what I had in mind (except I have HOB skimmer laying around that I would use). How do you handle angles since they aren't so tolerant to copper treatments? Any experience with fairy or flasher wrasses?

    @xroads@xroads Are there any species you would avoid with the freshwater dip & TTM method? I have heard it works wonders at eliminating ich without any chemical treatment. My only concern is it doesn't work on velvet but I suppose that's what an observation period is for.

    I'm on the fence still on whether to observe (maybe dip first) or treat chloroquine phosphate or copper prophylactically. Here's what I'm currently leaning towards... so please shoot holes in my idea before I go too far down a crazy path:
    I have a 55g I can use (can get other tanks during this $1/g sale as well) which I would plan on using as an observation tank.
    I would set up a smaller (20g) observation tank with substrate and some rocks for observing corals or inverts (possibly burying wrasses).
    I would set up a separate hospital tank (29g) for treatments if deemed necessary after observation. This is where CP or copper would be administered.

    Alternatively I could reverse the order of this method and send all fish into the hospital tank first to be treated for a month before they go to observation for another couple weeks. If I go that route I would probably want to get a larger hospital tank.

    Thanks everyone!
     
  10. xroads Veteran Reefkeeper Vendor

    La Porte City, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,014 / 6 / -0
    I dont think there are species to avoid with those two methods.

    Velvet is a parasite and should be able to be wiped out with TTM.

    The only bad thing about treating right away is most fish come in a weakened state. Copper and other medications can suppress appetite. So I would at least get them eating good first before treating them.
     
  11. Bud Loves Bacon Website Team Board of Directors Leadership Team GIRS Member Vendor

    West Des Moines, IA
    Ratings:
    +1,818 / 14 / -0
    I'm a fan of TTM but haven't actually used it...but if I were to pick one, that would be it. Works on just about every parasite. There is a very comprehensive writeup here: Tank Transfer Method

    The interesting thing I learned on that thread is that you have to keep the 2 tanks separated by a certain distance as ich can survive in aerosol transfer between 2 tanks...
     
  12. The quarantine process used at my work starts with a freshwater formalin dip for as long as the fish can handle it.(rolls onto side) then on day 2 we add cupramine and on day 3 prazi, I qt them for 30 days and I also feed them a gel
    Diet with crushed up sulfatrim tabs in it. It works. The only thing I don't really like is the formalin dip. I don't like seeing the fish do that but that's just me.
     

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